Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

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ccagneys
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Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:11 pm

Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by ccagneys » Thu Aug 31, 2023 5:21 pm

I am new to the Clare Past Forum.

I have noticed that there has been some information about my Great Great Grandfather Cornelius Loughery who lived in Boscobel House in Knockreddan . My brother and father have done extensive work trying to discover who his father was . It is still a mystery as we have not been able to find out any documents . Currently , I am trying to find his actual headstone in hopes that it will provide some information. I have looked at Doon Cemetary and nothing is there . I would love to find his grave or cemetary where he is at to say a prayer .

Corney Loughery has a death registered in the district of Quin in union of Tulla, Sept.13 1869 with Michael Hurley ,Abbeyview, present at his death. We believe he was born around 1824. He was married to Sarah Keogh,born about 1827 and died in US in 1907. There is a strong possibility that his father is Patrick Loughery. His death registered in Tulla citing he died 83 yrs. old in Ballinruan , 1865(Aug) with Thomas Houlihan present at his death. I would love to find his grave as well to say a prayer. We do not know he was married to .

I will be in Ireland and the area mid to late September 2023 and would be overjoyed if I could find where my family is laid to rest.

Thank you !
Last edited by ccagneys on Sat Sep 02, 2023 4:10 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Sduddy
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Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by Sduddy » Fri Sep 01, 2023 9:43 am

Hi ccagneys

Welcome to Clare Past Forum.

Your brother and father have done great work on the Loughery family tree. Records from the early part of the 19th century, for ordinary people, are scarce, and I am impressed by your finding that Sarah Keogh was baptised in Killaloe in 1827.

The records (online) of deaths between 1864 and 1871 do not include images of the original records, but I see the death of a Patrick Loughrey in 1865 registered in Tulla and the death of a Sally Loughrey the same year. I see that she had died in the quarter (of the year) before Patrick, so, if she was his wife, could not have been the person who reported his death. But I think there is a good chance that she was his wife – Loughrey/Loughry is not a very common name. I note that you applied to Births, Deaths and Marriages for the record of Patrick’s death and so you know that it was Thomas Houlihan who reported the death – he was probably a neighbour.

Regarding the Doon graveyard, it is pity that there is no headstone for the Loughreys there, but not every family erected a headstone – they knew very well where their grave lay and often graves were just marked with a stone, or not marked at all.

When you come to Clare in September, I’m sure you will go to Crusheen village, and see the church there, and maybe also to Ballinruan, where there is another church which still in use. Ballinruan church was originally known as Meelick church and records show that it was in existence in 1824. The building that we see now dates from 1857 and has been much changed over the years. Most churches are no longer left open – that day is gone – but you can say a prayer outside, or go there on a Sunday when the church is open for Mass. The register of Crusheen parish baptisms starts at 1860, so not all of the baptisms of the children of Cornelius Loughry and Sarah Keogh are recorded – just the baptisms of Michael in August 1862 and Hanna on 25 September 1866. Ballinruan church was the second church in Crusheen, and it appears from the baptism records that baptisms celebrated in Ballinruan church were included in the Crusheen register. This means that we cannot be sure whether the Loughrey children were baptised in Ballinruan church, or in Crusheen church. So try to visit both!

Last year I found the Loughrey family tree included in the Falvey-Mulcahy site online. I posted the link on 30 Nov 2022 – see page 43 of this thread - but I see that it is now marked “Confidential”. I forget if that family tree showed a relationship between the Loughreys in Doon and the Loughreys in Boscobel. It’s possible that the two families were only distantly related. If that is the case, then you should keep an open mind as to where the Knockreddan Loughreys are buried. For instance, they may have been buried in Clooney parish or in Kilraghtis parish. And bear in mind that they may have not marked their grave.

The Tithe Applotment books (1825) for the parish of Inchicronan show a Pat Loughry living in Doon: http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarc ... _00225.pdf. On the same page you can see Boskobell, and this gives the impression that Doon is close to Boscobel, but if you look at the map of Inchicronan (usually called Crusheen) you will see that the townland of Doon is quite a distance from the townland of Knockreddan where the place called Boscobel lay: https://www.clarelibrary.ie/eolas/cocla ... nlands.htm. The Tithe Applotment book for Inchicronan gives the names of those liable for Tithes in Boskobell, but does not list any Loughreys. However, this does not mean that there were no Loughreys living there. The Tithe Applotment books listed only those holding arable land. If the Loughreys were employed as herds or caretakers for the Butlers (landlords), who owned Boscobel House, they would not have been liable for Tithes.

That is as much as I can give you at the moment.

Sheila

P.S. I see from my notes on the erection of the O’Connell monument in Ennis, that the Clare Journal newspaper of Mon 28 June 1858 printed a list of those who promised to subscribe, and I see that the list for Crusheen includes Mr. C. Loughry. A total of £14 18s 8d was collected on Sunday 30 May by Rev. T. Mahony.

ccagneys
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Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by ccagneys » Fri Sep 01, 2023 5:46 pm

Shelia,
Thank you for your thoughtful and thorough reply.

I was inaccurate about Sarah Keogh's information. She was born abt. 1827 but we do not have the records. I am going to try to edit my post so that the inaccuracy is corrected . I would hate to have someone use that information as fact since we dont have any documentation. Upon searching for cemetary information , I came across the duchas.ie project of schools and student essays written about many topics. One of entry topics was graveyards. As a retired teacher, I found these very interesting and could hear student voices very clear.

My dad got information about the deaths of Patrick and Cornelius from the Four Courts .

Thank you again !

Colleen

Sduddy
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Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:07 am

Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by Sduddy » Sat Sep 02, 2023 9:50 am

Hi Colleen

Thank you for that kind reply. I see now that I omitted the baptism of Mary(?), daughter of Cornelius and Sarah in Nov 1860. The address is Drumloughry, which is a place within the townland of Knockreddan; sponsor: Mary Dillon, Drumloughry: https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls ... 5/mode/1up.
You mention editing your post and I suggest, when you are doing that, to also change “Cornelius” to “Corney” in the bit about the record of his death in 1869. Corney is the version of the name Cornelius used by the registrar and “Corney” will make things a fraction easier for any future researchers. Cornelius was a name beloved by the Loughreys and used very often by them in Clare and in South Co. Galway. So there may have been a Cornelius in Doon* and another in Boscobel.
Colleen, I think the father of Cornelius who married Sarah Keogh may have been also called Cornelius. The death of a Connor Loughery was also registered in 1869 and I see (online) that he was aged 84 in 1869. If that age is correct, Connor was born in 1785 and it is unlikely that he is the father of the children born to Cornelius Loughrey and Sarah Keogh (Hanna, for instance, was born in 1866). It is much more likely that Connor was the father of Corney and grandfather of those children - we can’t be at all sure of that, of course - There is also the strong possibility that Patrick Loughrey who died in 1865, aged 83 (born in 1782), was the father of Cornelius who married Sarah Keogh.
*Doon graveyard is in the townland of Doon, but the Loughreys, who may have been buried there, lived in the adjacent townland of Calluragh/Callura.

There definitely was a Cornelius Loughery/Loughrey in Knockreddan. The baptism records mentioned above give the address as Boscobel. And the death record your father got gives the address as Abbeyview which is very close to Boscobel in Knockreddan. Plus the records of both marriages** of Patrick Loughrey, who was living in Knockreddan, give his father’s name as Cornelius. But Griffith’s Valuation (1856) shows a Cornelius Loughrey leasing Lot 23 in Calluragh townland in Inchicronan (Crusheen) parish: https://griffiths.askaboutireland.ie/gv ... h=&height=
Cornelius in Boscobel, Knockreddan may be the same person as Cornelius in Calluragh. It would be interesting to know if that is the case.

**23 Feb 1870: Marriage of Patrick Loughery, Farmer, Drumloughrey [in Knockreddan], son of Cornelius Loughrey, Farmer, to Sarah Cotter, Cragg, daughter of Michael Cotter, Farmer, in O’Callaghan’s Mills chapel; witnesses: Michael Dillone, Mary (?):https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/ ... 060652.pdf

11 Feb 1885: Marriage of Patrick Loughery, Widower, Farmer, Knockreddan, son of Cornelius Loughrey, deceased, Farmer, to Ellen Moloney, Killenena, daughter of John Moloney, Farmer, in Killenena chapel; witnesses: Michael Crowe, Mary Fahy: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/ ... 966346.pdf

Colleen, I agree that the stories collected from schoolchildren in the 1930s are very interesting.

Sheila

ccagneys
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Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by ccagneys » Sat Sep 02, 2023 10:09 pm

Shelia,

Thank you again for Loughery information. I’d love to find a headstone, but being in Ireland close to where my Irish family is joyful in and of itself. On my first trip to Ireland several years ago, I felt so at home everywhere I looked…the faith, faces, smiles, gift of gab. I am so thankful for all my family who had their faith, the courage , and strength to face the challenges of immigrating to Chicago. I am here because of them.

I appreciate your advice so that others may search with accuracy.

Warmest regard,
Colleen

Jimbo
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Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2013 9:43 am

Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by Jimbo » Sun Sep 03, 2023 5:09 am

Hi Colleen,

Welcome to the Clare Past Forum.

When researching families in Crusheen parish it would be difficult not to come across the extensive research done by your father and brother. I was a bit late in discovering their family tree when researching a McNamara family line. If you search this forum for "Cagney" you will see when researching the McNamara's of Ahish in Caher townland who settled in New Haven, I first came across the mega family tree of your family members (August 2021).

http://www.ourlibrary.ca/phpbb2/viewtop ... &start=465

Then when researching the Linnane family tree of Glandree (October 2022), one of the Linnane daughters married James Moloney, who was the brother-in-law of Patrick Loughery (of the Crusheen Invincibles) through Patrick's 2nd marriage to Ellen Moloney. In the 1911 census, his nephew John Loughery, an orphan, was living with the James Moloney family in Glendree.

http://census.nationalarchives.ie/pages ... ee/370593/

And more recently (July 2023), when discussing the archaeological report of an abandoned house in Derryboy (Derrycaliff townland), there was an incorrect reference that the Loughery family lived in Derryboy (while leasing a plot there at Griffith Valuation, they lived in Ballinruan). Also, two of the McNamara daughters of Ahish (Caher), discovered from the Cagney family tree, married into Derrycaliff townland.

I have never had much luck with cemetery headstones, so much so that I forget to even look. There do not appear to be any transcriptions or headstone photos of Doon cemetery at the Clare Library website.

https://www.clarelibrary.ie/eolas/cocla ... s_name.htm

A forum posting back in 2015 asked about a headstone listing for Doon cemetery, but that part of the question was never answered.

http://www.ourlibrary.ca/phpbb2/viewtop ... f=1&t=6611

I googled Doon cemetery Ballinruan and came across the findagrave website and searched for Loughery. A findagrave user submitted an entry for Cornelius Loughery (1785 - 1869), but is this information accurate? I am unable to read the writing of the headstone included in the photo. The paragraph biography might well be accurate regarding Cornelius Loughery, but does it relate to the actual headstone?

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/249 ... s-loughrey

Okay, I've just taken a peak at the Cagney family tree with its Loughery branches, and see that this Cornelius is the brother or half-brother of your Patrick Loughery (1782 - 1865). And not included on the findagrave website are headstone photos in Doon cemetery taken by your family members, including one with this caption:
There is a gray gravestone in Doon Cemetery that was erected by Patrick [Loughery (1782-1865)] in memory of 5 children who appear to have died 1843 to 1856 (some maybe Famine related). No mention of mother of the children or whether Patrick himself is buried here.
An adjacent headstone (with photo) in the same Loughery plot is for a Patrick Loughery, son of Michael Loughery, and grandson of Patrick Loughery (1782-1865). This Loughery plot is nicely tended and with a cement boundary.

Since Patrick Loughery (1872-1865) paid for a headstone for five of his children who died young, I would expect that his presumed son Cornelius who died in 1869, as well as Patrick himself, who died in 1865, would have been buried in the same exact Loughery plot. But unfortunately without a headstone.

Sheila, would not this be the Irish custom to be buried in the same family plot? And the fact that there is no headstone wouldn't necessarily mean that they weren't buried there? This would be very different from American burial customs, so would appreciate an Irish view point.

Colleen, I reckon you should visit this Loughery plot in Doon cemetery and be fairly confident that your Loughery ancestors are buried there. I hope you enjoy your trip to Ireland.

When you are on the way to the Doon cemetery be on the lookout for the "Doon Coffin Stone", about a half kilometer from the cemetery used to take a break from carrying a coffin all the way to the cemetery:

https://heritage.clareheritage.org/plac ... s-in-clare

Sduddy
Posts: 1828
Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:07 am

Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by Sduddy » Sun Sep 03, 2023 6:36 pm

Hi Jimbo

Good work. Colleen will be pleased to hear that there are Loughrey headstones in Doon graveyard.
My reading of the inscription on the horizontal headstone in the photo is: “Sacred to the memory of Mary(?) Loughrey (a word I can’t decipher) dep. this (life?) (three more words I can’t decipher – probably the date) (a number – her age) Years. Erected by her Husband Conner Loughrey for him and posterity”. When an inscription includes “posterity”, and even when there is no “posterity” inscribed, I always take it that at least some of the descendants are also buried there. There are a few instances of it in my own family tree. Maybe it was considered that the surname sufficed. Afterall, the very grandest people just put the surname on their tomb. In the case of the O’Loghlen mausoleum in Ruan graveyard, there is just the family crest.

Sheila

ccagneys
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Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:11 pm

Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by ccagneys » Wed Sep 06, 2023 2:36 am

Jimbo ,

Thank you for your post ! I appreciate all you thoughts about Irish family, traditions and graves. I'm so glad that my brother and father's research was helpful in your search. I will be in Ireland soon and let you know if I gain any other insight or knowledge or DISCOVERY when I'm there . :)

Colleen

ccagneys
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2023 2:11 pm

Re: Loughery family living at Boscobel House 1800's

Post by ccagneys » Wed Sep 06, 2023 2:40 am

Shelia,
Thank you for you insight into the possible intention of the word "posterity "!
Colleen

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