Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Genealogy, Archaeology, History, Heritage & Folklore

Moderators: Clare Support, Clare Past Mod

murf
Posts: 365
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:58 am
Location: Qld Australia

Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by murf » Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:06 pm

I recently complained to the NAI that the parish of Kilnamona, Co Clare was missing from the above data set. They returned the following email, quoted verbatim:
Dear users,

Thank you all for your valuable feedback on the TAB site which was recently launched. I hope to be able to give at least preliminary answers to your questions in this email.
The information on the site was transcribed and indexed by our partners at the Genealogical Society of Utah. It is well beyond the small resources of the National Archives to carry out such a large task, or to be in a position to verify 750,000 names.
All records for the 6 northern counties are held in the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland.
There are a number of problems with the site:
1.Mistranscriptions of names and placenames: we are working to place an error transcription form on the site, to allow corrections to personal names, which should be available in a day or two. However, it is by no means certain that we will have the staff required to verify and input the suggested corrections. The issue of variant placenames, which often occur in the books themselves, requires greater scrutiny, and we will be working with our partners to try to remedy this problem, and mistranscriptions of placenames.
2.A number of parishes appear to be missing from the site; we are taking this up with our partners and will attempt to have them inserted. Please continue to let us know of any further omissions.
3.A number of parishes are mislocated in counties not their own; we are taking this up with our partners and will attempt to have them correctly placed.

We are extremely grateful for your feedback on the site, and will do our best to remedy the problems identified.
Yours sincerely,
Catriona Crowe
At the time that I was searching I did a quick count of the Co Clare parishes in the dataset. I can't remember the exact number but it was around 77 or 78, which may be 3 or 4 short.

murf
Posts: 365
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:58 am
Location: Qld Australia

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by murf » Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:41 pm

A further note to this.
Having regard to the mention of parishes misplaced in the wrong county, I performed a search inputting my ancestor's name (Lyons) and parish of Kilnamona and All counties, and lo and behold there he was in Co Cork!
The name of the townland (Gurteennaloughane) also matched.
I shall attempt to track down any other missing Co Clare parishes in a similar fashion and advise NAI accordingly.

Lucille
Posts: 144
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 6:59 pm

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Lucille » Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:26 pm

The townland of Annagh is also missing. We talked to senior people in the Archives years ago about this and apparently they checked the original documents and didn't find it. It may have been missed or lost or merged with Knocklisceraun

Lucille

murf
Posts: 365
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:58 am
Location: Qld Australia

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by murf » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:59 am

Misplaced County Clare Parishes in Tithe Applotment Book Dataset
By comparison with the transcribed Tithe Applotment records on the Co Clare Library website the following Co Clare parish records have been found to be misplaced as follows:

Records for (Parish, County) found in (Parish, County)
Inagh, Clare found in Dysert, Clare
Kilfarboy,Clare " " Kilfane, Clare
Killeely, Clare " " Killeely, Limerick
Killuran, Clare " " Killummod, Roscommon
Kilmurry Clonderlaw, Clare " " Kilmurry, Clare
Kilmurry Ibrickan, Clare " " Kilmurry, Clare
Kilnamona, Clare " " Kilnamona, Cork
Kilseily, Clare " " Kilscoran, Wexford
O'Briensbridge, Clare " " Killaloe, Clare
Ruan, Clare " " Dysert, Clare
St Munchins, Clare " " St Munchins, Limerick
St Patricks, Clare " " St Patricks, Limerick

I have sent a copy of this list to NAI.

pwaldron
Posts: 730
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:31 pm
Location: Ballina, Killaloe
Contact:

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by pwaldron » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:12 pm

St. Munchin's, St. Patrick's and Killeely all straddle the county boundary, so should probably appear under both counties - or be split up in accordance with the later mapping of townland boundaries.

Kevin J. O'Brien
Posts: 71
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:19 pm
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Kevin J. O'Brien » Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:55 pm

RE: Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish Tithe 1826 and 1834

The 4th June 1826 Tithe Applotment Book for Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish has 32 townlands listed on 71 pages. The record is well preserved and the hand writing is beautiful.
Under some of the townlands there are local district names that are not “official” townlands names but names used by the local parishioners. I have noticed that identifiers like East, West and Middle are missing from this Tithe, resulting in one Dunsallagh, one Shanaway, and one Clounlaheen townland. There is a townland listed as “Scrapple” that has current townland names as Doolagh and Crevagh listed under Scrapple and then there are townlands like Annagh, Finnurbeg, Finnuremore, Tromroe, Tromroe Castle, Rineroe, Mutton Island and Clounadrum that are not listed anywhere in the record. This has caused me to look very closely at this record in hopes that I could figure out who is who in the 1855 Valuation of Tenents. Most of the times I can see a pattern of families and figure it out but not always; the O’Brien and Sexton families from Clounadrum have remained hidden to my long searches.

Researchers and family historians that are interested in the Parish of Kilmurry-Ibrickane are fortunate in that on 23 April 1834 this parish submitted a “Recapitulation” of the Tithe to the Diocese.

This 1834 edition only has 21 townlands listed but does have Finnurbeg, Finnuremore, Tromroe, Tromroe Castle, Rineroe, Mutton Island and Clounadrum townlands and you get another snap shot of the parish 9 years after the first Tithe Applotment. This was important to me as I could follow the transfer of land from a father to son for my O’Brien family in Killernan townland.

I recently transcribed the 1834 Tithe Recapitulation Book and the County Clare Library will be posting it on the Parish site soon. The record is not as clear as the 1826 but it was readable and I believe the transcriptions are accurate. Let me know if I missed anything.

Another note on the early Tithe records is that the local names entered have been extremely helpful with indentifying family tombstones in the Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish graveyards.

I have the original 1826 Tithes on my O’Brien Blog: http://obrienkilmurryibricakne.blogspot.com/

Slan,
Kevin J. O’Brien

Kilfarboy Parish Tithe (Miltown Malbay) May 1, 1825. Not as easy to read as Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish
Note: Does not have the townland of Illaunbaun and found my Conole ancestor in the townland of Lackamore.
Last edited by Kevin J. O'Brien on Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.

smcarberry
Posts: 1281
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 4:31 pm
Location: USA

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by smcarberry » Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:03 am

Kevin,

Your description of the Recapitulation material is very enlightening. Please expand on that, as to where you found the Recapitulation records and how you obtained a copy in order to do the transcription. Is there any chance (in your opinion) that such Recapitulations exist for other parts of the county ?

Thanks,
Sharon Carberry
USA

Kevin J. O'Brien
Posts: 71
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:19 pm
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Kevin J. O'Brien » Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:19 pm

Sharon,

Thirty years ago I was in Dublin just starting my research and I had copies made of the Tithe Applotments Books for the townland of Killernan in the Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish. I ended up with both sets of photo copies. All these years I had not realized that the second copy was from the 23 April 1834 Recapitulation tithes.

Recently, I have expanded my search in the parish and ordered the microfilm from the LDS Family History Center. These records were filmed by the Genealogical Society of Utah, Salt Lake City, Utah in 1935. They have 140 microfilm reels in 35 mm for Applotment Books abt. 1824 – 1840. The parishes are in alphabetical order. I ordered Film # 256650 for the parishes of Kilmoon – Kilnaglory. I was fortunate in that the Kilnaboy Parish, Co. Clare and Kilmore, Co. Monaghan were on this microfilm. My wife’s family is from Monaghan and Kilnaboy, Co Clare is another Parish I have an interest. I did not see any other “Recapitulation” entries.

The Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish 1834 Recapitulation entries are continued on the microfilm immediately after the 1826 Tithe entries of Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish.

Slan,
Kevin J. O'Brien
Attachments
Tithe Applotment 1834 K-I Parish Killernan.jpg
Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish 1834 Recapitulation for Killernan Townland
Tithe Applotment 1834 K-I Parish Killernan.jpg (717.99 KiB) Viewed 33449 times
Tithe Applotment 1834 K-I Parish.jpg
Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish 1834 Recapitulation
Tithe Applotment 1834 K-I Parish.jpg (556.55 KiB) Viewed 33449 times

Lucille
Posts: 144
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 6:59 pm

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Lucille » Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:27 pm

Hi Kevin

Thanks for putting up those pages. You mentioned in Tuesday's post that Annagh was included - I don't see it anywhere in the list of 21 townlands. Am I missing something?

Lucille

Kevin J. O'Brien
Posts: 71
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:19 pm
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Kevin J. O'Brien » Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:42 pm

Lucille,

My apologies, Annagh Townland is not listed in the 1834 Tithe Applotment for Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish.

I edited my earlier posting and removed Annagh Townland.

Slan,
Kevin J. O’Brien

Lucille
Posts: 144
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 6:59 pm

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Lucille » Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:54 pm

Thanks Kevin. Seemed too good to be true!

Lucille

Kevin J. O'Brien
Posts: 71
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:19 pm
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Kevin J. O'Brien » Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:10 am

Lucille,

Do you need any help with Annagh Townland?

I have the Valuation Revision books for Annagh and church records for the families in the Annagh if I can help you.

Slan,
Kevin

pwaldron
Posts: 730
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:31 pm
Location: Ballina, Killaloe
Contact:

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by pwaldron » Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:05 pm

I have been asked why some townlands in Kilmurry Ibrickan were subject to only half tithes.

For example, Caherush on page 18 at
http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarc ... _00565.pdf
was taxed at 1s 5d/acre of 1st quality land, 1s/acre of 2nd quality land, 8d/acre of third quality land, 5.5d/acres of fourth quality land and 0.5d/acres of 5th quality land,
but Doonogan on page 28 at
http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarc ... _00575.pdf
was taxed at 8.5d/acre of 1st quality land, 6d/acre of 2nd quality land, 4d/acre of third quality land, 2.75d/acres of fourth quality land and 0.25d/acres of 5th quality land.

Can anyone explain the difference between Caherush and Doonogan?

Lucille
Posts: 144
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 6:59 pm

Re: Tithe Applotment Books Webpage at National Archives

Post by Lucille » Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:17 pm

Thank you Kevin for your offer of help with Annagh. It's just the one name, two families, in that townland - Anthony and William O'Dwyer. I presume the Valuation Revision book refers to Griffiths Valuation? If so I don't expect anything much (though obviously as I've never seen the book I can't know!). It's earlier I really wanted - we think the farm was divided at some stage between Anthony and William but have nothing concrete yet.

As for Church records, I have everything from 1839 on when the parish was divided, for both families, and I have been through the Kilfarboy records from 1828 several times but I still have 6 (at least) missing children of Anthony O'Dwyer and Ellen Gallery from 1829-1839. There was a suggestion that they might have been baptised in Kilmaley but I can't find them there either. Any sightings would be gratefully received - in fact that would be the under statement of the year!

Thanks
Lucille

Kevin J. O'Brien
Posts: 71
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:19 pm
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA

Re: Half Tithes

Post by Kevin J. O'Brien » Fri Nov 23, 2012 10:09 pm

Paddy,

On page 19 of the Tithe Applotment Book for Kilmurry-Ibrickane Parish written across both pages of the book it says:

"The Following Townlands Nine in number are subject only to half Tithes payable
to the Right Honourable the Earl of Egremont or to William Casey, Esquire
as his Lessee."


I always assumed that these nine townlands were a poorer quality of farm land and I did near this mentioned while conducting interviews while performing family research

Slan,
Kevin

Post Reply