Quinlivan of Ballyroughan

[pwaldron]

Probably the most frustrating family that I have ever tried to research in county Clare (or elsewhere, for that matter!) are the Quinlivans, who seem to have come originally from the townlands of Rathluby and/or Ballyroughan in the parish of Quin, barony of Bunratty Upper.

I am not descended from the Quinlivans, but am in correspondence with several proven, probable and possible descendants.

The proven and probable descendants of this family include farmers, corn merchants, many priests, a bishop, a mayor of Limerick, an award-winning actor, two Irish rugby internationals, a journalist and newspaper editor, the wife of an ambassador, etc. This has resulted in numerous references in print, many of them using tantalising but imprecise phrases like `near relative to' (e.g. Irish American, 11 Sep 1852, p.3) or `cousin'. Other references include blatant errors, e.g. the Old Limerick Journal of Spring 1981 at http://www.limerickcity.ie/media/Media,3939,en.pdf

(The OLJ article has two errors. Firstly, Fr. Michael Quinlivan died in 1894, not in 1904 as it states. Secondly and more significantly, his brother Laurence was not the Laurence who was Mayor of Limerick. Fr. Michael's brother Laurence married Margaret Hogan in 1861 and she was still alive in 1901 (census, Gower North townland). The Mayor married firstly Ellen Mary Kelly (d.1851) in 1850 and secondly Margretta Cullinan (d.1869) in 1863. Both errors are reproduced on p.4 of Fr. Thomas J. Morrissey's `Bishop Edward Thomas O'Dwyer of Limerick, 1842-1917' (Four Courts Press, 2003) and at http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/t ... 0969816126 ).

The earliest apparent reference to this Quinlivan family that I have found is in a lease for lives at http://museum.limerick.ie/index.php/Det ... t_id/20212, dated `18 June 1793', `witnessed by Edward Quinlivan', and in which one of the lives is described as `James Quinlivan, son of Lanc. Quinlivan of Rathloobain, Co Clare'.

I am merely guessing that Rathloobain was Rathluby. Am I correct?

Declan Barron has sent me this entry from the 1825 Freeholders list for Tulla Barony:

Laurence Quinlivan, Abode - Rath, freehold- Rath, Landlord - Mrs. Comyn, Lives on lease - Edmond, John and James Quinlivan.

Is Rath the same place as Rathluby? If so, why is it listed under Tulla and not under Bunratty Upper?

I have second-hand accounts of the marriages of two daughters of Laurence Quinlivan of Ballyroughan:

1. On 14 Feb 1790, a marriage agreement was registered between Tim Killeen of Moloska and Catherine, daughter of Laurence Quinlivan of Ballyroughan

2. The Limerick Advertiser, in 1813 (date not noted), reported the marriage of John Fitzgerald Currunekeale and Miss Quinlivan daughter of Laurence, Ballyroughan

I have not yet seen either of these sources myself.

Whether Laurence lived in Rathluby or Ballyroughan, I am reasonably satisfied that he had these three children:

a) Michael of Ballyroughan (c.1780-1862):
http://www.ourlibrary.ca/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=193 has: April 25, aged 82 years, Michael QUINLIVAN, Esq., of Ballyroughan, county Clare. This excellent gentleman was the father of the Rev. Michael Quinlivan, P.P., Kilacduan, and of the Rev. P. Quinlivan, of the Australian Mission.
Freeman's Journal 2 May 1862

b) Bridget m. (before 1810) William Meehan:
Five of their children are listed in the early Quin baptismal registers (1817-1823). Hugh Weir in Houses of Clare (1999. p.141) confirms that Father Michael Quinlivan of Gower Hall `was a first cousin of Father Meehan [c.1810-1878] of Moveen [sic, recte Moneen] at the time of the Little Ark.' (Strictly speaking, this too is just hearsay.)

c) James of Ballyroughan (c.1787-1857):
The Clare Journal of Monday 23 Nov 1857 reported the death `on Friday evening at Ballyroughan in this county, aged 70 years' of `Mr. James Quinlivan'.
The Tithe Applotment Books for Quin (1 May 1825) included:
Quinlivan Michael Part Ballyroughan Quin
Cunlivan James Ballyroughan Quin
Despite the different spellings of the surname, I believe that these were brothers.

I am altogether less certain whether the following are siblings of Michael and Bridget, or related in some other way, if at all:

1. Mrs Killeen above

2. Mrs Fitzgerald above

3. Edward Quinlivan (father of Mayor Laurence Quinlivan and grandfather of Bishop Edward Thomas O'Dwyer)

4. Mrs Jane Browne (see discussion at http://www.ourlibrary.ca/phpbb2/viewtop ... f=1&t=1697)

5. A twice-married Mary Quinlivan, wife of Edmond Palmer of Caherdavin (d. 21 Jun 1804, children bapt. 1799 and 1800) and Michael McCarthy of Shelbourne Cottage (m.27 Apr 1808).

6. Fr. Patrick Quinlivan
Clare Journal Feb 27 1860
`Deaths
At Lahinch, on Wednesday [22 Feb 1860], after a short illness, at an advanced age, the Rev. Patrick Quinlivan, formerly P.P., of Inagh. From the beginning of his sickness which he dreaded would prove fatal, he was constantly attended by one of the Ennistymon Curates. Though comparitively a stranger, and apparently friendless - he experienced much kindness and attention from both the parochial clergy, and the people.'

All six potential siblings appear to be of roughly the same generation and in cases 3, 4 and 5 I have found some imprecise or inaccurate reference to a relationship. The inclusion of no. 6 is purely speculative, given the number of priests in later generations of the family.

Can anyone out there provide any hard evidence to confirm the precise relationships between any of these Quinlivans?

[jquinliv]

Thanks for the Quinlivan information. I've heard Quinlivans from county Clare designating Kilmihill as the first settlement of Quinlivans in county Clare and I have heard from a relative that the people from the town of Quin said the same. Over here in the states just about anyone you run into doesn't know how to spell or say the surname, Quinlivan. I always tell them that it's just like Sullivan. Just replace the the Sull with a Quin. Which brings up another interesting item...what does and where did the 'livan' come from? Is it truly from Ireland or did this 'livan' come from the Normans or the Viking speaking nations??

Thanks!

[pwaldron]

I think two surnames ending in -livan is pure coincidence. MacLysaght's explanation of Sullivan or Ó Súileabháin is that while `there is no doubt that the basic word is súil (eye) there is disagreement as to the meaning of the last part of the name'. He identified Quinlevan (sic) as a Clare form of Ó Caoindealbháin (meaning gracefully shaped) which has also been anglicised as anything from Quinlan to Kindellan to Connellan to Conlan.

[pwaldron]

A little more detail from John O'Hart's Irish Pedigrees, vol. I, 1923, p.386, under Connellan:

Eanna, grandson of Niall of the Nine Hostages, `was the ancestor of O'Condeilbhain; anglicised Connellan, Cunelvan, Quinlan, Quinlevan, Conlan, and Conlon.'

There is a very long footnote re Quinlan, and a very short one re Quinlevan: `of this family was the late Alderman Quinlevan, of Limerick.'

[mgallery]

I have a transcript ( I think incomplete) of the will of Thomas Kenny pp proved in 1810 in the consistorial ct. In it he names 5 of his brothers among them Edmond my gt gt gt gt grandmother David my gt gt gt grandfather and his sister Margaret quinlivan. I had thought there was a quinlivan marrIage in that generation. We think that Margaret's husband was Lawrence of ballyroughane. Her children marry families to whom the Kenny's have close connection dwyer is one. I think Thomas had a 6th brother archdeacon james with whom he had fallen out.
I suspect there are more leases to be found

In later generation a Kelly who is a kenny descent ( of David) agaIn marries a quinlivan this is typical of the marriages in this family or rather grouP of interconnected families, Mahon(4 marriages I know of), Dwyer( 5 marriages i know of) Kenny,kelly of craggaknock (3 marriages I know of possibly 4) gorman( 4 marriages i know if), davoren(2), shannon(36 and gallery (3 but I think there are more) . I think there may be another quinlivan Kenny marriage in the 1700s Laurence Kenny was a land agent for the o briens in Newmarket. Laurence is not a common name. He may be from a differences unrelated Kenny family .

[pwaldron]

More on the Quinlivans and the Grogan family at
http://www.ourlibrary.ca/phpbb2/viewtop ... f=1&t=6623

[mgallery]

Hi
To revisit this topic. I am pretty sure, from dna matches, as well as from Wills and leases that Laurence Quinlivain of Rathloobain was married to Margaret Kenny, my gt gt gt gt aunt and 5 * gt aunt sister of David and Edmond Kenny (both my ancestors). I get a few Quinlivain descent matches as do Powells who descend from Edmond Kenny (Margaret Kennys brother) Their trees diverge from Clare ancestry mid 1800s so its pretty clear where their matches come from.

Paddy Waldron has a lot of research on this family. It is confusing and there are many members with similar names

rgds

Margaret

[Jimbo]

Hi Paddy,

It has been over ten years since you've first posted about the family "Quinlivan of Ballyroughan" and you may have already sorted out all your questions or perhaps lost interest.

The past few weeks the ongoing search for the missing Thomas McNamara of Glandree has led to Garruragh townland in Tulla parish. The Laurence Quinlivan of the 1825 Freeholder listing that you mentioned was not from Rathluby, but lived in "Rath" in Garruragh townland in Tulla parish. The landlord, "Mrs. Comyn", was the widow, Martha Harrison Comyn of Garruragh House. "James (Larry) Quinlivan" at 1855 Griffith Valuation was in Plot 15 in Garruragh townland. "James (Tom) Quinlivan" was in Plot 17. James Quinlivan and Mary McNamara had eight children, with a residence of "Rath" and Garruragh, between 1845 and 1862 in the Tulla baptism registers, with their first born son named Laurence. The Quinlivans of Garruragh had an uncle, "Rev. Mr. Quinlivan", mentioned in an 1851 hearing of the Board of Guardians at Tulla Union regarding the building of the Tulla Union Workhouse in Garruragh - see Sheila's findings in below link (page 53):

http://www.ourlibrary.ca/phpbb2/viewtop ... &start=780

Determining who the Rev. Quinlivan was in 1851 might provide evidence that the Quinlivans of Rath / Garruragh (Tulla) were related to the Quinlivans of Ballyroughan (Quin).

[mgallery]

there are an awful lot of Quinlivans - I am no expert but i did have access to a few descendants dna along with others of Kenny descent and used it to expand the trees.
Laurence Quinlivan who married Margaret Kenny had a son Michael (m Dundon) who had two sons priests. Either could be the Rev Mr Quinlivan , rev Michael 1814-1894 And Rev Patrick J. 1819-1869. I am afraid I know little about either but possibly one of the Quinlivan researchers will.
They are clearly related to other Quinlivan branches but I don't know how
rgds
Margaret

[smcarberry]

Margaret, I respond to your Dec. 6th posting, as Jimbo and Sheila are likely deep into further work involving the Garruragh-located Quinlivans, many of whom relocated to Australia (see their findings, posted on screens/pages 52 & 53 of the McNamara thread referenced by Jimbo above in his reply post here to Paddy Waldron). Since I have just done a little on Rev. Father Michael Quinlivan (your reference 1814 – 1894), I can tell you he was indeed the only Fr. Quinlivan with an official church post in County Clare in the early 1850s, using Battersby’s Catholic Directory as my source (a finding posted in the McNamara thread). Here is a good place to post about his younger brother, Rev. Patrick Quinlivan (1819-1869), who also was an active priest promoting church matters, but he did so in Australia, with his final parish being Port Macquarie NSW, a coast town. His life was cut short when he drowned, as reported in (among other newspapers) the Boston Pilot, 8 May 1869 edition, repeating an earlier Clare Journal article which distinctly had his father as Michael of Ballyroughan and his brother Rev. Michael stationed (at that time) in Ballynacally.

Rev. Patrick’s death took place on January 22nd (I believe, not written down during my news reading), which can be checked by using Australia’s Trove newspaper database, which also shows he (or his post-death lawyers) may have referred to himself as Patrick John O’Quinlivan. January in Australia is summer, while May is more like late autumn. Swimming would be a leisure-time activity in January there.

Reverends Michael and Patrick’s father Michael died 27 April 1862 at Ballyroughan, according to the Boston Pilot’s brief death mention, appearing in its May 31st edition that year. An obituary 21 Aug 1862 in Australia’s Sydney Morning Herald stated the father Michael’s age as 85, while also listing both sons (fully named) as priests in Kilmacduagh (Clare) and Port Macquarie (New South Wales).

Note also that the Boston Pilot newspaper, in its 26 Dec 1857 edition, listed “at Ballyroughan House” the death of James Quinlivan, Esq., with no age stated nor reference to surviving family members. Further research may show that this James was the same man of Ballyroughan with a fairly large set of children whose baptisms occurred in the Quin-Clooney RC register, from 1819 (daughter Margaret, godfather Laurence Quinlivan) through 1832, the forename Susanna used twice, and godmother Ellen Dundon for the 1821 baptism of James’s son Michael. Mother of all 8 children was Mary Dwyer.

Farmer Michael Quinlivan’s son-priest Michael’s birth year of 1814/15 has not been disputed although it was well before the Quin—Clooney RC baptismal register was started. Farmer Michael’s children in that register, all listed with their mother Ellen Dundon, are:
1817 Margaret sp. Jane Quinlivan
1819 Patrick [later priest in NSW] sponsors James & Margaret Quinlivan [Michael listed as “farmer]
1821 Mary sponsors Laurence & Margaret Meehan
1823 Eliza sponsors James Quinlivan, M. Burke
1825 Ellen sp. Margaret Quinlivan

The father Michael’s status as a farmer was well enough established that he through the years was consistently accorded the title of “Esq.” I don’t have Hugh Weir’s book on Clare manor houses, but I recommend looking for Ballyroughan House in that.

I haven’t purposely tried to find all the farmer Michael’s daughters in their marriage. I know in the Clare County Library’s Dunboyne Abstracts that Michael Quinlivan, Esq. Of Ballyroughan is listed as father to bride Ellen who married 1855 in New York City a Cork man named Coleman Lahan. The bride’s brother, Rev. Michael Quinlivan was listed as being in Newmarket-on-Fergus. This residence must have been while he was “Administrator of Quin” according to the priest Michael’s 1894 obituary, and likely his next stationing after his time as curate in Ennis, for which I have the Battersby’s listing in 1851.

Further research could determine that this nun came from the gentleman-farmer Michael’s family:
21 May 1897 Boston Pilot
“A venerable Sister of the Convent of Mercy, Ennis, Sister Mary Augustine, has been called to her reward. She was a daughter of the late Mr. Quinlivan, of Ballyroughan, near Trim [??, my note], and entered the convent in 1865.”
Another possible candidate was Mary born 1830, the daughter of Ballyroughan-based James Quinlivan and his wife Mary Dwyer, noted above in this posting.

That’s the sum of what I have on hand for the Ballyroughan Quinlivans, and I have no plan to do more. Anyone wishing to follow up on the gentleman-farmer’s wife Ellen Dundon will see that the Dundon/Dondon surname in East Clare is rare, but there are dozens of 19th-century obituaries on hand for that surname at the Limerick City Archives website. A 2021 publication, Oxford Dictionary of Family Names, places the Dundon surname primarily in Munster province, principally Limerick.

Sharon C.

[Sduddy]

I looked for “Quinlivan” among the Wills in the Will Registers 1858-1900 (National Archives): http://census.nationalarchives.ie/search/wr/home.jsp, and noted that Rossroe, in the parish of Kilmurry Negaul, is mistranscribed as “Rossie”. I don’t know if Michael Quinlivan, the “Gentleman Farmer” who lived in Rossroe, was related to the Garruragh Quinlivans, but Michael's brother, James Quinlivan, Ballyroughan, is mentioned as a beneficiary and was witness to the will. I’ve transcribed the will as an example of the kind of will made by comfortably-off farmer.

The 1880 Will of Michael Quinlivan, Gentleman Farmer

In the name of God, Amen, I, Michael Quinlivan of Rosroe in the County of Clare, Gentleman Farmer, do make, publish and declare this my last Will and Testament hereby revoking any will or wills or codicils hereto heretofore made by me. I give devise and bequeath my dwelling house offices and farm of Rosroe aforesaid unto my brother James Quinlivan of Ballyroughan in said county for his own absolute use and benefit subject however to and charged with the payment in ?(covenance?) hereinafter ?(commissioned?) of the yearly annuity hereinafter mentioned to my wife. I devise and bequeath all my stock of every nature and kind whatever on my said Lands of Rosroe at my decease, consisting of horses, cows and other animals and all my farming utensils and implements thereon unto my said brother James Quinlivan for his farming purposes. I give and bequeath all my household furniture (?) and plate of whatever nature or kind (?) in my said house at Rosroe or elsewhere at the time of my decease together with my b(?) horse bought at the late Doctor Kavanagh’s sale and my Phaeton and harness and covered car and harness to my said wife Kate Quinlivan for her own absolute use and benefit. I further give and devise and bequeath unto my said wife Kate Quinlivan to be paid to her during the term of her natural life the sum of one hundred pounds annually to be paid to her half yearly out of the said lands of Rosroe on which same is hereby charged by said James Quinlivan his heirs Executors, Administrators or assigns, on the first day of May and first day of November in each year, the first payment thereof to be made on the first of said days next after my decease, which said annuity is hereby secured(?) and charged and is an encumbrance on said Lands of Rosroe during my said wife’s life and in case of the non-payment of said annuity at any time on the days aforesaid to my said wife I wlll and direct that she may enter on the said lands of Rossroe and distrain for said annuity or any part thereof that may be due to her in same (?) as any Landlord may distrain for rent due to him or if no sufficient distr(?) on the lands to satisfy demand that then she may sue and recover said annuity as a rent from said James Quinlivan his heirs executors administrators or assigns for the use and occupation of said lands. I will and direct that any debts I may owe at my decease and my funeral and Testamentary expenses shall be paid out of the monies or money securities I may be possessed of as soon as convenient to my Executors after my decease and after such payments and also paying or deducting the two money legacies herein after mentioned. I give and bequeath the balance of all such moneys or money securities and cash I may have in my house or in Bank or elsewhere and debts that may be due to me in equal shares to my said brother James Quinlivan and my said wife Kate Quinlivan for their own absolute use and benefit. I give and bequeath unto my sister Mrs. Matilda Hickey of Knapogue the sum of ten pounds, and to the Superioress at the time of my decease of the Convent of Mercy in Ennis the sum of fifteen pounds to pay a debt my sister Maria considered she owed the Convent and bequeathed to me to pay. And I hereby nominate and appoint my said brother James Quinlivan my sole Residuary Legatee and my said brother James Quinlivan, Solomon Frost of Fenagh in the said County of Clare, Farmers, and John Elland of George Street in the City of Limerick Solicitor, Executors of this my last Will and Testament. In Witness whereof I hereunto set my hand and name this fifth day of May in the year of our Lord one Thousand Eight hundred and Eighty. Michael Quinlivan.
Signed published and declared by the testator Michael Quinlivan as and for his last Will and Testament in the presence us who in his presence at this request and in the presence of each other have hereunto subscribed our names as witnesses. Augustine Quinlivan, Ballyroughan. Patrick Hickey, Knappogue.
(end of transcription)

Sheila

[smcarberry]

All right, Sheila - adding here the 1880 will is a valiant attempt to augment Quinlivan data on the Forum. I won't try to tie in the mentioned people just now to anyone, but that "Augustine Quinlivan" at the very end, taken with Sr. Mary Augustine of the Ennis convent for which I provided a death reference here, may be enough for a motivated researcher to look for other instances of Augustine in James Quinlivan's wife Mary Dwyer's family. To date (so far as I know, being a casual observer) there is no such use of that forename in the Quinlivans in generations prior to the Quinlivan-Dwyer marriage.

What I want to do is confirm that you intuitively arrived at many accurate renderings of the fuzzy imaged words in the 1880 will. For the casual reader, online imaging of filmed NAI books renders nearly illegible many of the thickly-inked words on the real page. It helps to already know actual Clare locations, so kudos to you Sheila for instantly realizing that Nick Reddan's volunteer transcriber was way off on two locations: Rossie for Rossroe, and Ballgouraghra for Ballyroughan, with the latter mistranscription possibly confusing researchers looking for Garruragh so I hope you also alert the right person to get those corrected online. You did a great job of transcribing arcane legal phrasing (with which I am familiar due to my legal training). Thankfully the word "distrain" is clear amid other fuzzy wording. To my eyes, here is a phrase that stumped you on the second page:
"...or if no sufficient distress on the lands to satisfy demand that she may sue and recover the said annuity as rent from said James..." I also don't know why the word "distress" would be used in that manner.

The other phrasing that had you placing several question marks in your transcription actually seemed clear to me as I read through the will, for this phrasing on page one, in what would normally be the first paragraph (this document having no paragraphs at all, just being a block of wording without any commas but with (thank God) period points to end sentences). Here is what seems clear to me:
"subject however to and charged with the payment in manner hereinafter mentioned of the yearly annuity hereinafter mentioned to my wife..." Yes, that seems an excessive use of the word "hereinafter" which lawyers have loved. The other phrase which you seemed to question is also repeatedly used in this will and by old-time lawyers: "of whatever nature and kind" with this document's lawyer capitalizing the "k" of kind but not the "n" of nature. The other oddity like that is the varying capitalization of the letter "l" in the phase "lands of Rossroe" when that term appears not as the initial word of a sentence.

I guess we have to consider the fact that a Registry clerk was rewriting into the Registry book the actual document written by a local lawyer, submitted to be placed on file at the Registry of Deeds, Dublin. The benefit is that handwriting comparison then can be made by looking at other documents before and after the one being transcribed. However this particular Registry clerk didn't cross his "t" letter anywhere, so the woman's name Kate is written in the 1880 will as Kale, and bequeath and nature likewise have their "t" letters uncrossed. Also, this clerk didn't make any top loop when writing, for instance, the "f" in funeral.

By the way, you have "horse" transcribed on page one when you see the immediate 3 letters before it as possibly an adjective starting with "b." An alternative interpretation is one word starting with "b" followed by "ey" and ending in "hane" although I am clueless what a beyhane might be, as bought at Doctor Kavanagh's sale. I might try to find something online about that sale, as I am following Cavanaugh in that area of Clare due to a remote DNA cousin of mine.

Good for you that you figured out "Plate" follows the household furniture mention, but then you already knew what a Phaeton is, so again background knowledge is essential for fuller transcriptions. Just FYI, after the second use of "whatever nature or kind" the word "found" is used to refer to whatever of that kind was still in the house when execution of the will occurred.

Great job, and well worth your effort to provide us all more to work with.

Sharon C.

[Sduddy]

Hi Sharon,
Thank you for adding that helpful information to my transcription of the will. “Distress” was just a guess – also “horse” (purchased at Doctor Cavanagh’s sale), plus some other words.

Sheila

[Sduddy]

Hi Sharon,

Augustine Quinlivan was a son of James Quinlivan and Catherine Ryan, Ballyroughan. He was baptised on 4 May 1863, the eldest of the 13 children born before 1881 - there were more births after that date*. I think it was his aunt who was Sr Mary Augustine of the Ennis convent and that he was named in honour of her name in religion - this was a common practice.
From the moment that he witnessed the will, Augustine Quinlivan was destined to be the inheritor of the farm at Rossroe. It was Augustine Quinlivan (of Ballyroughan) who reported the death of Kate Quinlivan of Rosroe in 1897 (Kate was the widow of Michael who made the will) : https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/ ... 658761.pdf.
In 1901, Augustine is living in Knocknalappa (Rossroe DED) with his sisters, Monica and Susan: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/p ... a/1086671/
On 29 Apr. 1908, he married Sarah McNamara, from Six-Mile-Bridge, daughter of James McNamara, in St. Joseph’s church, Limerick: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/ ... 658683.pdf.
In 1911, Augustine and Sara have a daughter, Mary Josephine, aged 1: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/p ... pa/369158/
Sarah died in Rosroe in 1924, aged 52: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/ ... 371056.pdf
I think Augustine may be this Augustine who died (a widower) in St. John’s Hospital in Limerick in 1929: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/ ... 342400.pdf

* Susan and Christina (maybe more)

Sheila